Failing Motherhood

Executive Function + ADHD with Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart

September 27, 2022 Danielle Bettmann | Parenting Mentor - Wholeheartedly Episode 78
Failing Motherhood
Executive Function + ADHD with Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart
Show Notes Transcript

It feels like kids are getting diagnosed with ADHD at alarming rates lately! Have you ever worried about things you've noticed in your child, wondering if they need to be evaluated?

This episode is going to give you worlds of insight!

Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart, a pediatric psychologist, is here to share everything we need to know about executive functioning skills - the part of the brain responsible for social-emotional soft skills like task initiation + completion, organization, regulation, impulse control, and more - that continues to develop until the age of 24.

Executive functioning dysregulation disorders, like ADHD, come up in conversation when you or your child's teacher have concerns related to your child's listening skills, BIG emotions, hyperactivity or hyper fixation.

In this episode, she answers...

  • How does executive functioning develop?
  • What is normal and what is concerning?
  • When is it time to seek help or get evaluated for ADHD?
  • At what age is she comfortable diagnosing a child with ADHD?

DON'T MISS-

  • An easy-to-implement day-to-day activity every parent can do to teach + model several executive functioning skills at once
  • Tips for adapting your environment to support a child that's struggling
  • Insight into why a skill you've taught over + over may not be sinking in


// CONNECT WITH DR. ANN-LOUISE LOCKHART//
IG: @dr.annlouise.lockhart
Website: www.anewdaysa.com
Parent Membership Platform + Courses: https://drlockhart.mykajabi.com

I believe in you & I'm cheering you on.
Come say hi!  I'm @parent_wholeheartedly on Insta.

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Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Because I'm dysregulated, my needs haven't been met, but their behavior is exactly the same. So then what are you going to get? You're gonna get grumpy, irritated kids who maybe are rude. What are you yelling at? what's wrong with you? They cop an attitude back with you. So there's different reactions across the board because I'm in a dysregulated state. So I tell parents that your kids behaviors when you're doing parent coaching, our goal is not to change your kids behaviors. Our goal is to change your responses to their behaviors and for you to understand why they behave the way they do. And to also understand why you're triggered by certain behaviors.

Danielle Bettmann:

Ever feel like you suck at this job? Motherhood, I mean, have too much anxiety, and not enough patience. Too much yelling, not enough play. There's no manual, no village, no guarantees. The stakes are high. We want so badly to get it right. But this is survival mode. We're just trying to make it to bedtime. So if you're full of mom guilt, your temper scares you, you feel like you're screwing everything up. And you're afraid to admit any of those things out loud. This podcast is for you. This is Failing Motherhood. I'm Danielle Bettmann and each week we'll chat with a mom ready to be real. Sharing her insecurities, her fears, your failures and her wins. We do not have it all figured out. That's not the goal. The goal is to remind you, you are the mom your kids need. They need what you have. You are good enough and you're not alone. I hope you pop in your buds, somehow sneak away and get ready to hear some hope from the trenches. You belong here, friend, we're so glad you're here. Hey, it's Danielle. Welcome back to Failing Motherhood. Whether you feel like your child has ADHD for sure. Whether you're afraid of them getting diagnosed, whether you just want to know what's normal, or you just want more understanding so that you can be prepared down the road...do not miss this whole episode through and through. I am talking to Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart today. She is a pediatric psychologist, parenting coach, mom of two and business owner of A New Day Pediatric Psychology in San Antonio, Texas. She helps overwhelmed parents get on the same page and better understand their kids and teens. And in this episode, we start off with her admission of guilt for not wanting to bring her family on a family wellness retreat trip, which leads into a short conversation over the permission we may need to do things for ourselves and by ourselves as well as vocalizing those needs for our family rather than stuffing them back down and just doing the next thing anyway, which is a reminder that we all need to come back to. But then I get to pick her brain about all things executive function. As she shares a reminder, that's the part of our brain responsible for the social emotional soft skills, the task initiation and completion, organization, regulation and thought, which is very much still developing until the age 24. So I get to ask her, How does executive functioning develop? What is normal? And what is concerning? How do you know if your child has ADHD? And when do you know if it's time to seek help? And what age is she comfortable diagnosing ADHD? She also shares a go to exercise every parent can do that can teach and model several executive functioning skills at once. She shares tips for adapting your environment to support your child who may be struggling in any of these areas, and why a skill you feel like you have taught over and over again might not be sinking in for your child. So again, whether your child has already been diagnosed with an executive functioning dysregulation disorder, whether you have concerns about any of their listening skills, or big emotions and wonder if it's time to seek help, or if you are just planning ahead for the future and want to save this perspective... you are going to get so much clarity and understanding from this episode. So let me introduce you to Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart. Welcome to Failing Motherhood. My name is Danielle Bettmann and on today's episode, I'm joined by Dr. Ann-Louise Lockhart. Welcome.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Thank you Danielle. I'm glad to be here.

Danielle Bettmann:

I am so excited to meet you. I've been following you forever. And on Instagram. You're just so good at the content creation and making things so relatable and real life but also so informative. So kudos to you I do not have that that skill set.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

I appreciate that. But you do. I've been following you as well, too. And you have a really great way and a great perspective about sharing stuff. So thank you for being here. Thank you. Yes.

Danielle Bettmann:

It was definitely not the aspect of business that I envisioned. When I set out to work with families. I did not know I'd be making reels with viral lip syncing.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

It didn't even exist. It didn't exist, right? No, yeah.

Danielle Bettmann:

Here we are. Podcasting is much more my lane, I am all about being able to connect with all the fun people that I've gotten to interview. And I'm just so excited for you to be able to share your wisdom and your knowledge. And before we get to that I want to back up. So go ahead and introduce yourself to my audience and share who you are and who's your family.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Yeah, so I'm a pediatric psychologist. And that was my original initial training. And I've been doing that for about 16 years. And I'm also a parent coach. And I have my own practice in San Antonio, Texas, which is called A New Day, pediatric psychology. And I have been married for 23 years. And I have two kids. I have a nine year old son and a 12 year old daughter and husband and no pets, which my kids are trying to convince me to do. So. That's it for my household for now.

Danielle Bettmann:

Okay, we have two bunnies, and we keep getting talked into more things. What are they asking for right now?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

A dog My daughter has been researching since the middle of the pandemic, she has gotten really focused on getting a husky. And yeah, she knows everything about them. But she has a notebook with tons of notes. So Wow. Yeah, we're not quite ready for that just yet. We had a couple dogs when they were first little, but we're like, yeah, it's too much take care of dogs right now. So yeah,

Danielle Bettmann:

yeah, no, it's good to know your capacity. Yes. My oldest is really into a bird right now. And I'm just really trying to entertain the conversation without any guarantees or promises, because I don't really think anyone in this family is gonna thrive with. Love that for you. In theory, no, thank you. So in that same lens, have you ever as an expert in the field felt like you were failing motherhood?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. I just felt that a couple weeks ago, I was invited to go on a wellness retreat at family wellness retreat, and with a company and it was a small, very focused group of people. But a lot of the influencers and experts and business owners were bringing their families. And they were asking me if I was going to bring mine and I was considering it. And I'm like, wow, it was like a 12 hour trip going and a 12 hour trip coming. And I just thought that's going to be too much. And I just kept feeling like I think I need this for me. So at that moment, I kind of felt like I felt bad. Like I was like, well, I should want to have them come. And you know what's wrong with me? Am I a loser that I don't want my kids and my husband to come with me on a family wellness retreat. But I felt like I needed that. And when I went, I'm really glad I didn't bring them, I think it had been too much. And it would have been exhausting. And I really in that moment, I really realized I was because I wasn't going just on a retreat I was going to work. It helped me to be fully present, that I didn't have to worry about what they're going to eat and what you know, their sleep schedule and focusing on them. And I could just focus on what I was doing and meeting with people and engaging with people and doing what I do. And but it's amazing how sometimes when we want to do things for ourselves, that kind of guilt, parent guilt kind of creeps in like, well, you should want them to come with you. Or you know what's wrong, that you don't enjoy always being around them like, Well, no, they understand that it's okay for me to have my time just like it's okay for them to have theirs. But I think that was most recently that pops into my head. Because I had a lot of guilt leading up to it. And then I was like, No, I'm glad I didn't because that would have been. It'd been a lot. It'd been exhausting. Yeah.

Danielle Bettmann:

So it's good that you listen to that little tiny voice inside you. Yes, that intuition that just knew. Yeah, sometimes it's hard. It feels like it is yeah.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Because we have these narratives that play in our head. And every time I was like, wow, this is a delay. I'm here and then a two hour Uber ride after flying in the air for 10 hours. I'm like, Yeah, this would have been it's too much like it's too much. And then yeah, so I think we have to like listen to that still small voice and just feel like okay, I spend a lot of time with my kids. I do a lot of things with them. It's okay to do something for me. I don't usually struggle with that. But this particular thing I felt like I was it was really pulling on me. And I felt like I was doing something wrong with not wanting them to be there. But I think we have to really listen to ourselves and know that we don't have to always be a parent or mother all the time. We have different identities and it's okay to do that.

Danielle Bettmann:

Yeah. as well, thank you for that example and for giving that reminder that we have that permission, because one of the things you had written in as well, when I was gathering your information, was struggling with just wanting me time. And they're just there. That is so relatable. It's definitely a summer problem more than maybe other times of the year, depending on your kids age, but they're just there.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Yeah. And I just had that experience. Yesterday, I was working all day, it was a great day parent coaching sessions. And I was creating some content for a company I'm working with and came home and I was, my brain was exhausted from creating from being present. And my son, one of his ways of connecting is to connect is to be physically present all up in your space. And he was like, Hi, Mommy. And I was like, Oh, I, and he's like, What are you doing? And I'm like, relaxing. And I said, Sweetheart, I would really love to hang out with you. But I need some time to myself. I need to have about an hour to myself, and then we can hang out afterwards. He goes, Oh, okay, you need you time, of course. And it was like, Duh, because I've always done that with them. But I think on that particular day, because I'd been gone all day, and they'd been home away from me, I've it's like, again, that guilt feeling like, Well, I've been away from you all day, I should want to be around them. But for me, as an introvert, I'm a social person. So people think I'm an extrovert, but I'm very much an introvert. Because I can socialize and engage with people. But then I reached my max and I have to disengage to rejuvenate. And so for me after talking and engaging in creating and interacting with people all day, and then coming home, I need a time to decompress. And because if not, then the rage comes out. And I feel like then again, those guilt messages that I'm failing in this way, come out. But if I listen to myself, and I say okay, no, I need this me time and acknowledge it and say it, then I clear up any kind of confusion. And I think that we need to give ourselves permission to let our kids know when we want to be left alone.

Danielle Bettmann:

Yes, yes. And just being able to verbalize it because so much like it's screaming in our head. But we feel like we have to shove it back down and stifle it and just override it and keep doing the things and go play floor is lava or whatever they want us to play with them. And then they obviously get the vibe that we want to be anywhere but there and then we feel even more frustrated because he failed them. And we failed being able to stand up for ourselves. And we're just failing all over the place. But

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

and the thing about that too, Danielle is that then you think, oh, okay, I have all this mom guilt. So I'll just be present with them. I'll play with them. But you don't really want to be there, you feel bad, you're annoyed, you're rolling your eyes in the back of your head, but you're trying not to show it and so they're picking up on that totally. And so you're physically present, but you're not mentally present. So then when you're ready to then to withdraw, because you figure that I've given them cool quality time, but they don't feel like you were even fully present there, then that's when they're going to suck you dry, because you weren't really even present. And so then you're just like screwed up again. Because, you know, you should have taken the meantime to begin with rather than forcing yourself to do something you didn't really want to do. So we've all been there. I think we need to listen to that. Because then we're giving them mixed messages, right? I just saw one of your I think it was you someone I was watching those talking about, like, when you tell your kids, I'm fine. And you're really not. And so then they're like, wait, I think you were talking about that recently. And you know, then they're having to figure out like, well, she says she's fine, but she looks like she's like ticked off right now. Yeah, what is it that I'm reading? And so then they're getting confused by what they're reading off of your face or your body and what their gut is telling them about you. And it's confusing. It's confusing, because one day you're like Chippie cherry ready to play and the next day, you're just like, raging at them. And that's confusing for them,

Danielle Bettmann:

right? Yes, it is. It is. So really, it's most beneficial not only for you, but for them as well to just be honest and say I do not have the ability to play right now. And it is not your fault. It is I've had a long day, and give me some time. And then I'll set a timer after that timer is done. I am more than happy to listen to you about whatever you know is going on from your day or whatever was important to you. And just setting that boundary, then you're teaching them that they can do the same thing later on. And it creates such a healthy role model to learn from, but just that initial, can I even do I have permission to do this to stand up for my own needs. And being able to say them out loud, is hard is because Matt might not have been modeled for you.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Exactly. And you're modeling good self care because you're showing them that you don't need to burn your self at both ends. And you don't have to always be productive. You don't always have to hustle. You don't always have to be working all the time. And communicating that and allowing them to know that it's okay to take that break. I think that we don't as parents, we don't do that enough.

Danielle Bettmann:

All right. And right now unfortunately, there was a lot of reasons why we're not okay. Oh, yeah, right now? Oh, yeah. The stress has only compounded for reason upon reason upon reason. So it's not an if it's a when, when you don't feel like you have to give, it's okay, take that time, take that space and just say it out loud. I am not okay, right now, I need some me time. And it has nothing to do with you. And I have a plan to take care of my emotions, I'm gonna go do this. And then we'll be back. And that will create so much healthy communication around the board. Well, and

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

the thing to there's also different levels of engagement, right, there's some where you completely disconnect, and you shut your door and put a chair behind it. So they come in, there's where you just you're in there, and they can see you, but they're not engaging with you. It could be where you're lying on the couch while they're playing, and you're observing their play. It could be while you're laying on the couch and commenting on their play, so that they're having you watch them and observe them doing that thing that can feel just as connecting to my kids love when I do that. Because then I'm like watching them. And they're like performing. And then they're looking back at me. And so it's like you're still engaged, it could be where one of the things my son really loves to do is watching like music videos from the 1900s. So I'll show him like 1980s music videos of like some of my favorite music artists. And that's our way of connecting. And so for me, it's a great decompression, because I love music. I love creativity. And so it's a good way to decompress while still connecting with him. So he's getting what he needs. And I'm also getting what I need to. So it doesn't have to be were a way to rejuvenate is to fully disconnect, it could be that you're connecting in a way that you mutually connect on things totally. So you both getting your needs met.

Danielle Bettmann:

Yeah, my daughter and I did that yesterday, she really wanted to show me things that she had been making in Minecraft, and usually mean that that's just not my top favorite thing to do. But I was tired and you kind of taken a lazy day it was raining outside. So I just laid in her bed next to her. And she showed me all the things and how it all worked. And I just asked questions, and I don't think there was anything I could have done to fill her cup more. And so love that it was a win win across the board totally. So whatever that looks like for you, I hope that gives us like we paint a little picture of the different options you have in that moment. So now I want to shift into your level of expertise, and the things that we can pick your brain about, that has to do with ADHD and executive functioning and some of the disorder that can come in play. And so I would love for you to just give us kind of a 411 on brains. Like, if we haven't been to school for a while, just give us that reminder of what do we got going on? And what do we need to know to be able to access to what's going on in our child's

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

fantastic, okay, one of my favorite topics. So, in our brain, we have four lobes, at least most people have brains, some people act like they don't. So we have four lobes. And we have the cerebellum as well, that's at the base of the brain. So the cerebellum is responsible for a lot of things that we don't have control over. So like our breathing our digestion, like things that are automatic, the occipital lobe is in the back of the head. And that helps with visual processing, seeing, being able to know what we're seeing and interpret what we're seeing. The temporal lobe is on the side of our head, it's where temples are. And that helps with memory as well as hearing. So being able to hear something and then interpret and process what you're hearing, the parietal lobe is in the back top part of the head. And that is responsible for what they call proprioception, which is knowing where your limbs are in space. So if you're doing a handstand, knowing that your head is underneath your legs, for example. So those all those parts of the lobes of the brain, those are all fully grown and developed by the time you are born. And they're working for the most part, and it's done. But the frontal lobe in the prefrontal cortex is the last part of the brain to grow and develop and that's behind your forehead. And that doesn't finish growing until about age 25-26. But the frontal lobe is super important because that's where all your executive functions are. And executive functions are things that like decision making, planning, problem solving, flexibility, emotional regulation, impulse control, working memory, processing speed. Yeah, lots of important stuff. Like, okay, I always think like, wow, that should have been developed first, right? Because there's a lot of executive functions that are going on self monitoring, knowing how you're coming across to other people knowing if you have an attitude and how to shift your attitude. Like all of that is executive functioning. So When we're looking at our brain, and we're looking at how kids and teenagers act, and we wonder why they can't act, quote, right? Well, it's has to do with their frontal lobe and their executive functioning. Because many of them, they don't have a developed frontal lobe. And then on top of that, if they have a dysregulation disorder like ADHD, then they have a slowly or poorly functioning frontal lobe. It's not a stimulated as it needs to. So then now they have a double whammy, they have an underdeveloped frontal lobe and then on top of that they have an under stimulated frontal lobe, which then causes more problems like time management, for example, or self control, or attention. Those are all executive functions.

Danielle Bettmann:

Right? Okay, you painted a picture so well, I'm here, I'm in the brain with you. Hey, if you're new here, I'm Danielle. My company, Wholeheartedly offers one on one and group coaching programs to help families with strong willed kids aged one to seven, prevent tantrums, eliminate power struggles, extend their patience and get on the same page. It's kind of like finances, you can read lots of info about what a Roth IRA is and how the stock market works. But if you really want to get serious about paying down debt or growing your wealth, you go see a financial advisor who can give you very specific recommendations based on all the unique facets of your situation. I'm your financial advisor for parenting. And I've designed the way we work together to give you nothing less than a complete transformation. While we work together, I'm able to help you figure out why your child is losing their mind and why you are losing your mind and guide you to master effective long term solutions through three main focuses. Number one, my cultivating cooperation guide, teaching you the tools of positive discipline. Number two, managing your mind by working through my triggers workbook. And number three, establishing your family's foundation by writing your family business plan. My coaching is comprehensive, practical, individualized and full of VIP support. So if you struggle to manage your child's big emotions, if you and your partner's arguments seem to center around parenting, especially if one of you is too kind, and one of you is too firm. If you struggle to stay calm and be the parent that you want to be, it's possible to stop feeling like a deer in headlights when a tantrum hits, effortlessly move through simple directions and care routines without an argument and go to bed replaying the way you handle the hardest moments and feel proud. If you have a deep desire to be the best parent you can be, and your family is your greatest investment, find me on Instagram, send me a message that says SANITY, and I'll ask you a few questions to see if we'd be a good fit to work together. I can't wait to meet you. Back to the show. What is the typical timeline for early childhood have kind of some of like the mile markers of when we can reasonably expect some of these things to come online?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Well, that's a hard question because it depends. It depends on so many different factors. Because at different stages of development, social, emotional, sexual, physical development, all those kinds of things interact with things in addition to experiences, in addition to mental health diagnoses or adjustments, believe trauma, any of that kind of stuff that may be going on could impact the way the brain grows, develops and interprets information. So that's a harder question to answer because it really depends on the individual child and the environment in which they live. I think that's why it's important to make sure that we keep in mind when we're expecting kids at different ages to know how to do different things, we have to look at the overall development in general. So what I would tell parents is look at what the American Academy of Pediatrics, for example, in the CDC says in terms of typical development, like what should my kid be doing at different stages, and then looking at that more soft markers where it's a general range, because it's not going to be hard and fast, a general range of what kids should be able to do at each stage. And once you can do that, then you can say okay, where's my child falling is are they right? Where they're supposed to be? They're more advanced? Or are they falling a little bit behind compared to their peers? So it really would depend on the individual child and their home environment. But we want to look at in general, what I would say is look at in general, like what is overall cognitive, social emotional development at each stage, because it will vary based on what exactly we're looking at, since there's multiple factors,

Danielle Bettmann:

right?. And so how does the executive functioning develop?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

It develops through one-the brain growing over time. That's One because it's just a natural function of the brain growing and maturing. And another one is because they are functions, they are skills. So they're taught and modeled and learned over time. So even if they have a dysregulation disorder, the way kids learn the way the brain learns to manage time to make decisions to plan to problem solve, to regulate their emotions, that's through modeling. And that's why as a parent, that's why our job is so important. Because in order for our kids to learn how to do these things, they have to see us doing it, and then we have to teach them. That's also why I'm so passionate about teaching schools and school districts and teachers these things, because schools focus so much on testing and standardized testing, which don't matter at all, when they should really be focusing on executive functioning. And a lot of the research shows that within the first eight weeks of school, the school year, what schools and teachers should really be focusing on is teaching executive function skills. Because if a student knows how to tolerate frustration, one of the skills if they know how to be flexible, when things don't go their way, when they can learn how to regulate their emotions, and practice self control and inhibit responses and other executive functions, when they learn to engage with others and watch their tone and their eyes and all that kind of stuff, another executive, and when they can learn all these things, then when they're learning a hard concept in math, and they can figure it out, rather than exploding and reacting. If they have frustration tolerance and self control, they can learn to manage when things are hard. So I think our focus really should be on modeling and teaching and practicing and role playing these skills, so that kids then learn them, and they're equipped with them. Because knowing how to manage those parts of yourself in your brain equips you to be more successful academically, socially interpersonally, and to have better self esteem, because then you're not beating yourself up with like, oh, I shouldn't have reacted that way. Because I hear that from parents of kids all the time, when they were will do something, they'll have this reaction. And I'll ask the parent, you know, after the meltdown for two hours, what does your kid do? And many times we're like, oh, they felt really bad, or they will apologize. Or you can tell that they feel shame or guilt about it. Like they know when they're acting up. They know when they're doing this. They just don't have the skill set for how to regulate themselves. So a lot of executive functioning is really about a natural developmental course. But it's also about teaching and modeling that's so important that we have to teach it, we have to model it on a daily basis.

Danielle Bettmann:

Yeah, and one of the things I saw, and I think in your website was a dysregulated parent will have a dysregulated. child. Absolutely. So break that down a little bit more.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Yes. So one of the things that I often hear, and I experienced it myself. So say, for example, I come home and say after school, and I pick up my kids from school, and they're super hyped up, and they're giggling and running and laughing and being really wild. And I'm in a really good mood, because my needs have been met. I had a great lunch, had some prime rib egg rolls and some fries and talked to a friend had a good drive home, had a great day at work, and I'm feeling happy, great. Their giggly, over silly hyper behavior is going to be funny to me. I'll giggle, laugh, I may even be hyper with them. But another day may happen. And my order was wrong. I didn't get to have lunch, had some doozies of some client, you know, didn't show up or was rude or whatever hit traffic came home, and then they're doing the exact same thing and another day, then I'm gonna be like, "be quiet. Why are you so loud? Go to your rooms," right? Because I'm dysregulated. My needs haven't been met, but their behavior is exactly the same. So then what are you going to get? You're gonna get grumpy, irritated kids who maybe are rude. What are you yelling at? what's wrong with you? They cop an attitude back with you. So there's different reactions across the board, because I'm in a dysregulated state. So I tell parents that your kids' behaviors when you're doing parent coaching, our goal is not to change your kids behaviors. Our goal is to change your responses to their behaviors and for you to understand why they behave the way they do. And to also understand why you're triggered by certain behaviors. Why does that bother you so much when they chew with their mouth open or whatever? Like, why is that so triggering for you? So I think really the parent mindset and your regulated state is huge, because then you can help co regulate their dysregulation. Because you can give them something they don't yet have because they literally don't have it. So your calm state is so so important for maintaining a consistent and harmonious home. Because you have to give it you can't let your kid run the environment in your home so that you're feeling on edge because they're on edge because you're on edge.

Danielle Bettmann:

Right. I think that's a point that every listener will be able to apply. You know, wherever your child is on their executive function path is perspective, you need to understand that it does kind of trickle down from the top. And we are very influential in the skills that we are modeling and how much they can pick up from less than what they absorb, like a sponge, from their environment, and from that dynamic around their relationships, which feels like a lot of pressure. But hey, we're all learning along the way.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Well, and like you'd mentioned earlier too Danielle, you know, in terms of like asking, what ages do different executive function develops? And I think why that's a tricky question to answer. It's because they can develop all of them at every age. I have a colleague who's deaf, and he has a little toddler, super cute. And he has been teaching her problem solving and self task initiation, since she was super little. So like, if she wants to crack an egg, you know, even a to cracking egg and trying to figure out how not to get the shell and how to crack it the right way. And like, has been doing it over time and getting better and better at it. That's like problem solving. That's task initiation. That's all that kind of attention focused all that stuff. So kids can learn any of these skills at any age. But again, it's that teaching and modeling and then giving them opportunities to practice it. So that over time, again, it's a skill, it gets better and better and better as their brain matures. But we have to wire it that way. Because our brain is constantly creating new synapses. And it's pruning old ones. So if you're not practicing a skill, you'll start to lose it. So we want to have them teach it and learn it. And over time through repetition, that long term memory consolidation occurs, it gets stored in the hippocampus deep in the brain. So that way, when they have to access something like, Okay, wait, that person just roll their eyes at me, I thought she was my best friend, what should I do? Okay, well, I could cuss her out, I could slap her or I could walk away. Or I could ask her what's going on? That's problem solving skill, that's impulse control. Like, they can't do that at 15. Unless you've been teaching them since they were two doesn't mean they're gonna get it right away. It's that repetition, repetition, repetition,

Danielle Bettmann:

right. And so often, when kids expressive vocabulary is so highly sophisticated, then we start to assume, clearly, they are capable, and have mastered all of these things. And we can just expect it now. Because they know better. And that it's like a facade. It's an illusion.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Because their vocabulary can be super sophisticated they can be and more and more kids are speaking earlier and earlier. So because their expressive language skills are so you know, fine tune and then delete, then we think, oh, yeah, they must understand things. Well, they might understand, but they might not. Because expressive develops sooner, but they might be able to understand, but they can't carry it out because they still have an immature brain.

Danielle Bettmann:

Right. So just remembering that, is there a go to exercise that's really good for parents to do with their kids? Because it hits several executive functions at

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Hmmm that's a good question. I think one once? that I like to use a lot. And I'm trying to think if it works for a lot of them is like talking things out loud. So for example, say if I'm cooking, about to cook something, this just happened in a couple of weeks ago, daughter had a sleepover. She wanted me to make some pumpkin muffins, but I didn't have anything to make. But I had things to make the banana muffins. So I took it out. And I was like, Oh, darn. She's like, What? I was like - Wait a sec. I don't have anything to get the pumpkin muffins. She's like, Oh, man, I'm like, I know. What can I do? And I was like, well, maybe, you know, I have stuff for banana muffins. She was like, Oh, those are good to make. Okay, so I think I have what I need. I need the eggs. I need the bananas. I need the milk. I need that. Okay, I think I have what I need. Okay, great. I think it'll take about 30 minutes or so. And that whole thing, what I've just showed her is frustration tolerance, because I don't have what I needed. I have problem solving. So figuring out what to do, I have decision making having the list of ingredients and items, impulse control, because I could just be like, ah, you know, and freak out and, you know, create a mess in my mind. And in this situation, I have task initiation, because I could just give up. But instead, I'm just saying, No, I will just do what I can with what I have. And then task completion doing the thing and having a good product. So I think with talking problems out loud models, a lot of things because what I often hear and my kids have told this to me too, when I've done that, they've often and I've heard this from other kids that they say that they look at adults, and they think we have life figured out, right? Because we do a lot of that in our head. And we have a problem and we just do it or we tell them I'm fine. And so they don't see us working through the problem. But yet we make them do it. Why did you do that? Why did you hit your sister? What was going through your head when you hit her? You know? And so like, what, um, well, I saw her face and I hit it. Right like, so we make them think about the consequences of their action or the motives behind their actions when they just do it because they're impulsive. Right? They're not thinking through that. But so if we can talk out loud, whatever dilemma we have, whether it's playing a game, whether it's driving in traffic, whether it's, you know, having someone be rude to us in a customer service interaction in a store, like talking those things out loud, or afterwards, even, that, to me models, a lot of multiple executive function skills at the same time. So I think that's a really good one, actually,

Danielle Bettmann:

that is a really good one, because it's very doable, very accessible, we're always gonna have problems. Yeah. And again, having permission to talk about them out loud, and to show visible frustration and to, like walk not have an answer right off the bat of how you're going to fix something, or solve the problem or have a new plan allows your kids to see you as humans that are available that make mistakes, or that you know, have these ups and downs of your emotions. And it's okay to process those in real time. And I'll even do that after the fact, like you said, if they weren't a part of my workday, and I pick them up from camp, I can say, oh, man, guys, did I tell you about what happened today, there was a problem with like recording this podcast. And you know, the software wasn't working. And so I had to figure that out and just being able to kind of narrate that just gives them a little glimpse into what that looks like, at that, you know, more sophisticated level.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

And you can even, like, talk about what you wanted to do and didn't do, which practice which shows them impulse control, I just want to throw that microphone out of the window. What it wasn't working, yeah. But instead, I took a breath and said, it's not the end of the world. Problems have solutions, like you could be really real about it. But also tell them what you wanted to do and didn't in the situation. And that man, it's it really shows so much stuff, because they're seeing the process. And they're seeing how you aren't perfect, either. And that maybe or if you did screw up? And how are you going to make amends and corrections to it too, you know, so that they don't always see you having success, right. Sometimes they see you with the stuck, or with the failure as well, too.

Danielle Bettmann:

Yeah. Or actually throwing the microphone.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Right. Exactly. Yeah, through it. And now I broke the glass and the microphone. And now I have to get a new one. And I realized maybe I should have done that. Right. Yeah.

Danielle Bettmann:

Not the ideal one, but also a learning experience.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Yes. Right. But shows that you're also human and that, you know, just like they mess up, you mess up too. So I think it's a good human connecting experience between a parent and a kid.

Danielle Bettmann:

It is yes, we sometimes feel like there's a pressure to be the enlightened one, the Yoda that just bestows all of their wisdom and knowledge. And we just have all these lessons ready to teach them If only they would listen, and very rarely what truly happens. So okay, I feel like that's a super good generalized look at executive function and how to kind of instill that in our kids. But then what breaks down or what's going on in a child that might have either some red flags, or diagnosed ADHD.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

So it looks so different for so many, because it's such a, it's not called a spectrum disorder, but it falls along a spectrum. Because ADHD is considered an executive functioning, dysregulation disorder. Anything related to being regulated, can be dysregulated. So thoughts, emotions, behaviors, any of those things will be in a dysregulated state. So you might have a kid who's super inattentive and cannot focus to save their life, that you're talking to them. And they're like, off in lala land. But on the other end, you might have a kid who's hyper focused and get so focused on something that everything else gets lost. So maybe because that's where people often get miss it, because they're like, oh, there's no way my kid could have ADHD because they will read Harry Potter for five hours. And I'm like, and not do what oh, they forget to use the bathroom, they forgot they had a homework assignment, they forget they had a playdate with a friend. I'm like, well, that's hyper focusing. And when you are hyper focused, that's also dysregulation as well too. So it could either be inattention or it could be significant, hyper focusing. So you might see that you might see a kid who gets super obsessed with one thing and focus on one thing to the exclusion of all others. You might see things were a big one is that they have a hard time making friends. Or they might make them and have a hard time keeping them because again, everything's dysregulated so maybe they have that one friend, but they are are super clingy. And they don't have any other friends. And then they wear out their welcome with that particular friend or they're super bossy or they say things that might be insulting to the friend. So they often have issues with social interactions and friendships. Another thing that parents might be aware of too is that kids with ADHD, do things like wetting the bed longer than what is typically are developmentally appropriate, because everything is dysregulated. Once again, they tend to have a hard time falling asleep. But once they're asleep, they're like knocked out. So when their bladder tries to wake them up to go to, like you're having the bathroom dream, go to the bathroom, they sleep through it, and they don't even feel themselves starting to wet the bed. So there have a lot of things including eating and sleeping, and friendships, attention, all of that stuff tends to be very dysregulated. Or maybe you might have a kid who has these big tantrums or big explosive behaviors, when things don't go their way, they get easily frustrated. That's frustration tolerance. And that's another kind of dysregulation stuff. So whenever you have a kid, whatever age they are, if you feel like the things that they're doing feel like it takes so much effort, so much work and you don't feel like they can bring themselves back to that regulated state. You may want to look at seeing a child psychologist or child neuro psychologist for an evaluation or an initial screener with the pediatrician to just see okay, is this typical? Is this normal? Do I just have a very active, engaged, creative child? Or is there something not quite going right? Because it's impacting their grades, or it's impacting their friendships, because lots of kids with ADHD are super bright, and they do great in school. So their academics aren't impacted. But it might be other areas like focus, or friendships or sleeping or that kind of stuff.

Danielle Bettmann:

So before we have every single listener, assuming that their child has ADHD, can we remind them of what is normal? Or where a line would be where it really starts to be concerning or affecting their day to day life?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Yes, so there are three types of ADHD. There's inattentive type, hyperactive, impulsive, type, and combined type. So for inattention and again, you have to meet a lot of criteria to be diagnosed with ADHD. So even though a lot of people think, Oh, well, every kid has these things. Well, it takes a lot of checking off the boxes, to meet criteria. So you have to have six out of nine symptoms of inattention. And an attention might be things like procrastination, significant procrastination, where they're not able to follow a conversation through, they're easily distracted. They don't have the things that they need to complete an assignment. Like, they may bring home their textbook, but forget their notebook, they're very forgetful, have a hard time tracking things. Those are things that are it's significant, and it causes significant impairment. in multiple areas of functioning, you're gonna have kids who are distracted, you're gonna have kids who forget things, but it's significant impairment. It's like it's constant, it's constant. And it has to be present in two or more settings. So if it's just at school, but they're great at doing homework at home, or they're horrible, you know, at school in terms of focusing, but they get their homework done great. When their whatever it is, it's like it has to be present in two or more settings. Same thing with hyperactive impulsive. These are kids who look, it's not just a kid who's hyper. It's a kid who looks like they're being driven by a motor. They're always on the go. They are like the Energizer Bunny, they talk nonstop, you know, walking nonstop, can't even sit at dinnertime, constantly talking have a hard time falling asleep, are blurting out answers before you finish speaking, constantly constantly, like saying things out of turn, those are all things to just be aware of in terms of the ADHD. So when you look at that, for the developmental, what's developmentally normal and appropriate, these are kids who, again, looking at developmental stages for your child, like what should kids be doing at this age? And is my child falling into that category? Or are they going above and beyond? Or falling below? What's normal? So I think you always want to look at, okay, where's my kid? And then asking even the teacher like how my kid is behaving in school, like even if they're hyper? Is this similar to how other kids are behaving? Or is this worse then? Does it seem like you're constantly having to redirect them? Is it seem like they're constantly forgetting things that they need? Are they doing their homework but forgetting to turn it in? Are they you know, having a hard time interacting and engaging with friends? So I think we have to also pay attention to in relation to other kids, and what is normal for my kids developmental stage, how are they behaving? So it really would depend on what age group we're talking about here.

Danielle Bettmann:

And is there a typical age Are they kind of cross a threshold into the ability to diagnose where there's a too early time period?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Well, I've seen kids as young as three and four get diagnosed with ADHD. And I don't like that, because I think it's a little bit too young. Typically when it starts where you people can get diagnosis when they enter school, or when they're at school age, like age five, or six. Because when they're at home, and before being in a structured environment, it's really hard to know like, what is a typical behavior for them and what's kind of developmentally appropriate for ADHD, they can be diagnosed, really, the signs and symptoms should be present by age seven, it used to be earlier, I'm trying to remember now seven, between seven and 12, a lot of times you'll see more symptoms develop. But there's no, the thing is that what I've often found is that people will come in as like a teenager or college student rather, or an adult and say, Oh, I think I caught ADHD or I have ADHD, or my work gave me ADHD, but they don't have any childhood or adolescent history of ever having any of these symptoms. And you can't just have a new diagnosis of ADHD for the first time as a 20 something year old as an adult. What that looks like is that it could be stress, it could be lack of sleep, it could be medication side effects, it could be a medical diagnoses, there could be other things that have happened that caused you to have that. And that's why with ADHD, I tell people that for me, I see ADHD as a rule out diagnosis. Because so many things look like ADHD. Even typical child development looks like ADHD, right? A hyper kid looks like ADHD, a kid with too much sugar looks like ADHD kid who has been abused homeless, who's had prenatal drug exposure, a kid who's have post parents have been divorce, kids who has been bullied, who didn't get enough sleep, didn't get enough to eat, like a lot of things look like ADHD. So I think you want to always look at all the factors that it can be and rule all of those out first say, Nope, it's not that, it's not that, it's not that, it's not that. Okay, now, what are we left with? Let's look at what could it be now that we know it's not because of these things. So it's very easily misdiagnosed. Because of that if you don't take a holistic complete picture of what's happening in the family, in the school in the system, with the kid in their body, medically, you have to look at all of it.

Danielle Bettmann:

And do you find that it is harder or more girls are missed in the diagnosis period, because it's harder to see recognize some of those symptoms?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Absolutely. The girls tend to be diagnosed more often, with ADHD inattentive type, and inattentive type. ADHD just doesn't cause problems in the school system. They just seem like they're in their own world. So many times girls are missed, because they're not causing problems. They're not hard to teach in general, because you're not causing problems in the classroom. And they just seem like they're in their own kind of world on land. So they're kind of often missed. And if they are diagnosed, they're often diagnosed with things like anxiety, because ADHD and anxiety look a lot alike. And because it's that avoidance, it's that withdrawal, it's that being in your own world, it's that kind of all that stuff, it looks very similar. So girls, more often than not, are missed, and boys tend to be more diagnosed with the hyperactive impulsive type ADHD, because it's more disruptive. It's harder to have them in the classroom, it's harder to have them at home. They are just so hyper, so much energy, that they do a lot of impulsive things that get them in trouble. And so people are quick to say, oh, that kid is so ADHD, look how they're always moving all the time,

Danielle Bettmann:

right? It's a lot more textbook,

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

or it could be that they're just a really active kid.

Danielle Bettmann:

Especially if they're four or five.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

That's why I don't like it when they're diagnosed too early. Although there's times when I'll see kids as young as three, four or five, where I'm like, Okay, let's monitor this kid because their level of activity and behavioral, you know, outbursts is much more than it really should be like, it's causing so much disruption and impairment, that it's not just a typical developing kid, there's something else going on.

Danielle Bettmann:

And is there one or two ways to be able to differentiate between anxiety and ADHD?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

I think that's where a good evaluation comes in. Because you don't. I think a lot of what happens when I see people come in and their kid has been diagnosed by a pediatrician, but all they've received is a screener that you're just check boxing. I think that's the worst way to do it. You want to use a screener, as a screener, not as a diagnostic tool. A true diagnosis needs to come from a psychologist who has been trained to do psychometric testing, that they're using subjective measures and objective measures. The subjective measures means they're talking to you. They're talking to the kid, they're observing the kid. They're asking you questions. They're using a clinical interview in terms of the different symptoms objective testing is when they're using maybe like an IQ test that's standardized, or an achievement test that's been standardized, or an ADHD rating scale that has been used to diagnose other kids to look at your kid in relation to other kids. So combination of those two needs to be done in order to get a good history. So then with that, if you're suspecting maybe anxiety or depression, then they can also give you diagnostic tools to look at, okay, are these anxiety symptoms present? Are these depression symptoms present? Because only then can you really know using subjective and objective measures? Whether your child really is this or this or this? And this? Yeah, cuz that's possible, too, could be more than one diagnosis.

Danielle Bettmann:

Right? Okay. And then for, this is the last thing I have to ask for anyone as a parent that feels like their child could work on executive function skills. They're dysregulated in some way, and it's affecting either they're overwhelmed or organization, or just, you know, thriving as a whole. What environmental adaptations, could they start making to support some of that with their child?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Really great question. I think it depends on what executive function skill they really want to work on. But I would say overall, one of the biggest things that kids with executive function challenges tend to be challenged by is overwhelm. Overwhelm is a big thing. Overwhelmed by the amount of homework, overwhelmed by the amount of chores, about the amount of mass how much they have to clean up. And I think one of the best ways is to decrease that visual clutter. Because the more stuff you have, the more likely you are to get cluttered. So even kind of having toys on a rotating schedule. So having certain toys out and putting the rest away, or really having more of a minimalistic room or playroom so that not every you know, single toy that they own is out. And just having that just eliminating a lot of the visual clutter can eliminate a lot of the overwhelm. So that way, it's harder to get things messy. So I think and then even doing things like making sure everything has its place. Having all the books in one place all the Legos in one place all the Barbies in one place, like having things having a place for everything. So I think it's just reducing a lot of the visual clutter. And a big one to that I want to add too is a concept I learned a few years ago, which was really cool, called body doubling. And that's where you're basically present with your kid either doing it with them, or just being present with them. So that when you're asking them to do a task that you know, they find it challenging, that you can support them as they do it so that you're again teaching and modeling. So if their room is a wreck, and you want them to clean up, rather than demanding it before they have any TV time, teach them how to do that. So chunking it saying, Okay, you pick up the books, and I'll get your Legos. Okay, let's go. Good. Awesome. We got that done. Five minutes. Okay, so now you pick up all your dirty clothes and put them in the hamper, and I'll hang up all your clean clothes. Awesome. Okay, I'm gonna clear off your desk and you make up your bed. So just being present with them can help. And then as they've learned that, then as you go on, just you being present in the room can help them do that stuff. That's where the body doubling comes in. So you just reading a book, while they're cleaning up the room and just chatting with you, that can help build motivation, and it helps to build focus, and then they can get that done. So again, we're always looking at, we're building skills, and we have to do it over time for them to learn it. Because otherwise they won't learn it if they feel like it's under threat or pressure. Because then again, that's dysregulated state and they're not going to get anything done.

Danielle Bettmann:

Right. So I think that's such a good point to make. Because there's so many times that we try to teach, and they're not teachable. And we're like, we taught that. Check the box. Really none of it got through at all. No, if they were emotional, if they were defensive if their guard was up, because you know, they felt attacked in No, it's not creating that long term strategy we're looking for.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Right? So if they were under threat, or you were being threatening, or you were being angry, then yeah, they're just in survival mode. And so any, quote, teachable moment was lost. So if you're like, I've taught this 10 times, and you're like, Well, were you in that state of mind when you taught it, because yeah, it wasn't learned. Because when we're under threat, we're trying to guard ourselves in some way or we withdraw. So logic doesn't get engaged, and we're not going to learn anything that was just quote, unquote, to talk to us,

Danielle Bettmann:

right? But I love that body doubling because I know that that helps my daughter with violin practice, where it's a challenge for her to you know, create that 15 minutes and, you know, go through the rote memorization and the things that she genuinely sounds not great and that you know, she really has to build up that frustration tolerance of like, yeah, the violin doesn't sound good when you're doing and being able to keep working through the practice that her teacher recommends, when I just sit next to her, it helps so much. So I'm really glad you brought that up.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

And that's not just with ADHD, it's like, you know, I think people have to remember that executive functioning isn't ADHD, right, ADHD is an executive functioning disorder. But you can have several executive functioning challenges and not have ADHD, like, I have a hard time with organization of papers, not with other people in a bag. But right, oh, my gosh, I hate it. But if my husband is present with me, I can get it done within 15 minutes, the body doubling like, right, but for other things, I'm great at it. So it's like, we have to also remember not to over pathologize our kids. And even if you're like, Ooh, that sounds like my kid, they have a hard time sleeping and they wet the bed, doesn't mean they have ADHD, it just means that there's some executive functioning challenges. And if you're concerned that there's multiple that's causing impairment, then you should get a screening and or an evaluation to determine what to do next.

Danielle Bettmann:

Yeah, and just like you said, like, if it's affecting more than one setting, and it's affecting more than one area of life, those are definitely things to consider. But every kiddo has worked to do an executive function, because it's literally just still forming and growing. Exactly, we still have some work to do as well.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

And our brain has done growing, it's actually going downhill. We have, right, so we have to remember, but that's again, that's that synapses and pruning. So if we want to stay strengthened and strong in a particular area, we then have to practice it. That's why you have professional organizers, right? And people who help you work out and coach life coaches, because we don't have it all together, either. But how we learn it is by having someone guide us along in our journey. So we have to do the same thing with our kids too, so that they can learn how to do those particular skills. Yes.

Danielle Bettmann:

And that's why we both work with parents, because we know it starts and ends with us. And we just need a little support and a little more accountability and a lot more examples and individualizing it all into what that looks like at bedtime tonight. And yeah, I love it. Because I can see the light bulbs go off. And I can see the learning happen when we just really open ourselves up to that commitment of going, having that person walking alongside. Yes, exactly. Okay, so that gives us a good launch into, how can listeners connect with you? Where are your platforms? And what are you doing right now?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Yes, so they can find me on my website at A New Day S A (as in San Antonio).com. So anewdaysa.com. That's my practice on Instagram, and Facebook. So on Instagram, I'm most active at Dr dot Ann Louise dot Lockhart, and then Facebook at A New Day Pediatric Psychology. And I think those are the best ways. And then if you go to my website, you can also find information about the courses that I have. I've multiple courses in areas from high sensitivity to ADHD, to anxiety, sleep, all kinds of different things. And then I also have an online parent membership platform to help support parents in their journey where we do live group coaching calls, and you have access to the courses. So that's the work that I'm doing. So needed.

Danielle Bettmann:

I'm so glad you've created all of that. And we have that so at our fingertips. So the last question that I ask every guest that comes on is, How are you the mom that your kids need?

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

So I think a big one for me is that I fully am present and love being a mom, and a wife, and a psychologist, parent coach, business owner, that it's showing them that I live as much of a balanced life as possible, and that I love and I'm passionate and enjoy it all that I have true joy and contentment in the things that I do. So that when I'm a mom and I'm with them, I'm fully present when I'm with my husband fully present when I'm doing my work fully present and that it's that I get joy from it. And I share that joy out of it. And I think for me, that's how I'm able to fully be present. I'm able to model that for them. And I think they love that I do the work that I do. My son brags about me all the time at school and says My mom is famous. And they're like she's not famous. He says, Has your mom been on ABC News? I don't think so. Like, I think that, to me, brings me such joy is like stop telling your friends that I'm famous. But it's that to me, that's how I'm the mom that they need. And that I want to be because I have joy in the things that I do. And I share it with them. And they share it with me as well, too. So I love that the work that I do in the work that I do is also informed by my parents successes and failures too. And I think to me for being a mom to them makes me a better parent coach and vice versa. So yeah,

Danielle Bettmann:

yeah. Oh, that's so great. They're so lucky to have you. Thank you. And he can brag all day. That's true. Yes, totally. I think it's hilarious. But thank you so much for your time and just being able to share all of those tiny tidbits that are just going to be really impactful. I think that our help listeners feel more confident in supporting their child's development and their brain development and just understanding them better. And knowing when it's okay if they need to seek help. They are the parent that their kid needs as well. Exactly. Thank you so much.

Ann-Louise Lockhart:

Thanks for having me, Danielle,

Danielle Bettmann:

of course. Thank you so much for tuning into this episode of Failing Motherhood. Your kids are so lucky to have you. If you loved this episode, take a screenshot right now and share it in your Instagram stories and tag me. If you're loving the podcast, be sure that you've subscribed and leave a review so we can help more moms know they are not alone if they feel like they're Failing Motherhood on a daily basis. And if you're ready to transform your relationship with your strong-willed child, and invest in the support you need to make it happen, schedule your free consultation using the link in the show notes. I can't wait to meet you! Thanks for coming on this journey with me. I believe in you, and I'm cheering you on.